My question: “Is this book as extraordinary as I think it is?” So I invited a friend (an out-of-the-box thinker who also makes me laugh) to join me for fish and chips overlooking the Pacific Ocean in Capistrano Beach, California. Connor White also read this book before our lunch appointment:
JOHN: Tell me if I’m off-base, but I think I could pick a page—any page—in Bill Hull’s book and find fresh insights about God and reasons to believe.
Plus: LOL humor! I’ve never read a book quite like it.
CONNOR: You’re right. (
How’s your lunch?) Bill Hull, obviously, is incredibly well-read. He’s super insightful—and amazingly self-deprecating.
JOHN: Totally! (
And the fish and chips are great.) In the “debate” section of
Time to Stand Up, he channels David Mamet, the playwright, director, and screenwriter. Hull’s hilarious back-and-forth with Mamet has the playwright responding, “Mr. Hull, you give satire a bad name. There is no business like no business, and looking at your social media numbers, I’d suggest retirement.”
CONNOR: I loved this book. As a Christian leader, pastor, and author (and a fan of Bonhoeffer and Dallas Willard)—the author dares to allow himself to be misunderstood. No dumbing down of his content. The debate chapters in his book spotlight his incredible creativity.
And—he is so, so funny!JOHN: I agree. The debate section—11 short chapters and just 95 pages of this 388-page book—amazingly imaginative. I’m wondering who were your favorite debaters—and how did they fare? You’ll recall he “invited” five to speak in favor of the proposition and five who opposed it.
CONNOR: Right. And all 10 “guests” at the debate had to be living—except immediately Hull violates his own rules (hilarious!) and brings two debaters back from the grave for this pretty serious topic:
“Jesus is God come to earth in human flesh. Yes or
No?”
JOHN: I was intrigued by his line-up:
•
For the Proposition: Andrew Klavan, Larry Alex Taunton, Dr. Scot McKnight, Nancy Pearcy, and G.K. Chesterton (1874-1936).
•
Against the Proposition: David Mamet, Don Henley, Jordan Peterson, Oprah Winfrey, and Hannah Arendt (1906-1975).
CONNOR: I’m still amazed at his deep research and the book's unique format. Here’s this imaginary lecture hall for “The Great Debate,” and Hull pulls it off so well, you feel like you’re right there. His color commentary during the breaks—between debaters—is often very funny. He has guts: taking on a life-changing topic, but with irreverent one-liners!
JOHN: Exactly. He notes the fork-in-the-road observation by C.S. Lewis:
“If Christianity is false it is of no importance. If it is true it is of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important.”Then, in describing debater Nancy Pearcy, Hull writes: “You know how hard it is to find a woman who likes to argue? Nancy is a great apologist and wins most of the time, just ask her husband.”
CONNOR: Ha, ha! I had to laugh at why he didn’t include C.S. Lewis as one of the debaters: “I would need to say he would be much too smart for our debate and he smoked constantly. Plus, I have it on good authority, an apocryphal rumor, that he and brother, Warnie, cut out of church a bit early each week because the local Pub opened at 11:00 and they wanted to get a good seat. Sounds awfully fleshy to me.”
JOHN: So…getting back to my question—“Who were your favorite debaters—and how did they fare?”
CONNOR: Wow. Tough to pick just one or two. Hull’s “on-stage” introduction of
Larry Alex Taunton is classic. Taunton speaks for the proposition and, in real life, has debated Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, and others. In 2007, he organized "The God Delusion Debate.” I laughed at this:
“I would like to tell you that Larry is an internationally known figure of great renown, but the truth is he is internationally known by people who are internationally known.”Hull describes Taunton’s stunning travel adventures (
“He makes Rick Steves look like a piker…”) so I’m tempted to read at least one of Taunton's books, maybe
Around the World in (More Than) 80 Days.
JOHN: Ditto! This jab by Taunton during the debate jumped off the page:
“Atheists claim that God doesn’t exist because evil exists. How do they know to call it evil? Because they have a God-given knowledge of what is good.” (See
Romans 1:18-32.)
CONNOR: I was also intrigued that Bill Hull included Oprah Winfrey in the group of naysayers. I don’t think her fans would appreciate that.
JOHN: Bingo! Hull writes:
“Oprah loves Jesus, but not the one in the Bible. Jesus claimed he was sent to judge. Oprah wants justice, but she doesn’t want Jesus as her judge.”CONNOR: One more. No spoiler alert needed here, but your readers will also find out why Hull positioned
Jordan Peterson as a "NO" and why Hull thinks “…not long from now he will be switching teams.”
JOHN: Right…no spoiler alerts, although readers might guess who wins the debate in the end. But before lunch is over—and you have to go back to work, we should talk about the rest of the book. (By the way, great family photo on your
White & White Construction website!)
John recruited Connor White to add color commentary to this review of Time to Stand Up. (Pictured: Connor and his family.)I counted 46 short chapters (and 46 striking illustrations by
Kris Hull)—perfect for your next 46 weekends: a chapter every Saturday or Sunday! Major sections:
• The Age of Anxiety (6)
• Elon Musk Wouldn’t Mind Being Saved (10)
• The Great Debate (11)
• Seven Deadly Sins (7)
• The Church That Came in From the Cold (3)
• Salvation by… (9)
CONNOR: You mentioned you first read the three chapters in “The Church That Came in From the Cold."
JOHN: Yes. I love books that don’t require a sequential reading. Hull describes a four-day seminar he attended and comments, “I don’t like being put into situations where I am asked to do silly things, where there is great pressure to conform. An odd hang-up for a pastor, but I have found that is not rare.” Yet…during one exercise, a “somewhat manipulative, even childish activity” he was subjected to, the experience actually prompted a spiritual wake-up call.
CONNOR: Wow! Along with Hull’s deep insights, we also see his deep transparency. This was unbelievable! He admits:
“I returned to the church, confessed my sin to the entire congregation, and I began my quest to love from a satisfied soul.”JOHN: After reading that, I felt I could trust
Bill Hull’s work—and enjoy his insights and humor even more. As I told you, I don’t think I’ve ever read a book quite like this one. And by the way, Hull blogs regularly on
Substack and is a
prolific author. I have two of his books on my “
Library of Candidates” book shelf—yet to read.
CONNOR: And…how brilliant to include those 10 chapters on
“Elon Musk Wouldn’t Mind Being Saved.” As Hull points out Musk’s successes and sins (and there are many on both sides of the ledger), he weaves in thoughts from Dallas Willard:
“Few people stop to ask themselves if they deserve to live in paradise. They just want to. And when they don’t get what they want, they feel insulted.”JOHN: Hey, we’ve barely scratched the surface of this extraordinary book. Any last comments or questions?
CONNOR: Yeah. Are you going to eat all those fries?
TO ORDER FROM AMAZON, click on the title for
Time to Stand Up, by Bill Hull.
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